Abstract

This interview is on Mrs. Carolyn Griggs. In this interview she talks about her childhood and her school life. Growing up was pretty fun for her, it wasn’t until her adulthood actually she started to receive a bit of segregation/racism. More details will be explained during the transcript of interview. Get Ready to Listen :)

Research

History tells us who we are. It is the collective story of what it means to be a Philadelphian. To live here. To work here. The African American history collection online seeks to give visitors a snapshot of the complex history of African Americans in Philadelphia. The Museum is proud to present its first online exhibition, a compilation of 200 diverse objects spanning five centuries that illustrate the broad experience of African Americans in Philadelphia, at work and at play, dealing with struggles and celebrating successes.

Resources

http://www.philadelphiahistory.org/african_american

Interview Below

RaVaana Griggs: Hello my name is RaVaana Griggs and I am conducting an interview with Carolyn Griggs.

RaVaana Griggs: My first question is, Where were you born? What was it like in the city you grew up in?

Carolyn Griggs: I was born in Philadelphia,Pa in the year of 1966. Uhhh Philadelphia to me has always been a friendly place, a lot of different ethnicities and just a good time growing up just having a great time with my youth is what I can remember. Lots of fun with my family and friends.

RaVaana Griggs: Ok, have you ever experienced discrimination?

Carolyn Griggs: Well, I’ve experienced various discrimination most recently in my 48th year of life and while I was conducting a um track championship in Bloomington Indiana. I was the only female of African American descent who was part of the management staff and I had a crew of 8 individuals working um on my team and most of them were, I would say there were 7 white males and 1 caucasian uhh female. I introduced myself to the group unn there was really no response from the group and kind of uhh, I felt that I wasn’t, I wasn’t to be part of their management or to be a leader for that particular group. Umm Uhh as I spoke to them in a group setting and gave them instruction uhm I over heard one of the individuals say, “ I don’t take instructions from a black women uhh this is our stadium and I’ve always worked here, I’ve always been the head uh for this type of event I don’t know why they brought someone like this here”. Umm but part of what I do is manage uhm races for youth athletes of various ethnicities and backgrounds, gender both male and female and, we have a management team a diverse group and I just happened to be in charge of the other starters who start the races the that group. Umm that comment it was very disturbing, at first I wasn’t gonna say anything because, I am from Philadelphia and I’m in a strange town not knowing um a lot of the individuals there but I know that is the home of the Klu Klux Klan and that is one of the uhh very uhh predominantly umm white areas, where everyone in town basically looks the same. There is not a lot of diversity in that little small town where we were conducting this championship and they just happened to win the bid and had the resources to such a, an event. I did bring it to the head of my management staff and umm they spoke to the individual about the comments that were made and umm the person was basically escorted from the venue and was not allowed to participate for this umm seven day event.  Umm later in the evening the person came to me and asked if they could speak to me, yes I ablibged to speak with them and they wanted to appologize they said “ they had not umm had anyone of my ethncity come and be a head or manager over them and they felt uncomfortable with that” but I said “ It’s 2014 and I know you see and watch TV you read you, your, and,and you’re twice my age I know you’ve seen African Americans before and our commander and chief is one so I don’t know uhh why you would make that comment and, and not think that you could, think that you could get away with it and did not be addressed. I am unfortunatly sorry that you feel the way you do but uhh as you live on in life and as I do so myself um don’t dissrespect other just accept them for who they are um and just move on with you life and I’ll do the same and it was an experience that I’ll never forget but it didn’t change how I felt about people, some people are ignorant and in there ways and set in there ways, there’s nothing you can really do but just educate them about one how to conduct themselves in, infront a group setting of,of various ethnicities we have so many different umm ethnictities and we all get along very well together so that was my, my experience with discrimination.

RaVaana Griggs: Okay, Growing up how did you feel about caucasian people?

Carolyn Griggs: Uh,um growing up most of my teachers were caucasian I had a few African American teachers and we were taught at home um just to respect others as a as you were to respect yourself, to treat everybody with kindness and care and we really didn’t look at color to much yes, we read about it in books, saw it on television as I said growing up in 1960-1970’sit was a pretty interesting time in our culture and just our years but again not feeling the brunt of that but just seeing uh changes were we had more opportunities as African Americans to, to attend um  you know schools of higher learning and, and to be offered better employment and housing and so on and so forth it really didn’t have an impact on me in my young life I just saw that changes in  just were amazed at the you know contributions that African Americans made to society as a whole.

RaVaana Griggs: Okay so, How to you white people thought of you as an individual?

Carolyn Griggs: Well, I.. am very confident and know for a fact that I was very well thought of and so was that of my family and basically the circle of friends that I had, because we were about our work and about moving forward and doing great things and helping in the community and church and our neighborhoods and always my parents were apart of the um we had the, what was it?, home and school association. My mother was there when she could, to contribute to any events that we had at school and supporting um our community so um we were always regarded, treated with him regard and that from what I can regard

RaVaana Griggs: Okay, did you got to a school that was mixed or predominantly on race?

Carolyn Griggs: My elementary school was predominately African American was Commodore John Barry Elementary School located and 59th & Race Sts in West Philadelphia.

RaVaana Griggs: What were you experiences in school?

Carolyn Griggs: My experiences in school were excellent umm I always loved to read,and worked really hard uhh and I would help with uhhh my teachers, as I would be first to finish tests and they would let me mark test and just umm feed my creativity and thirst for knowledge so I always had a wonderful experience in school.

RaVaana Griggs: Okay, do you your mother or father experiencing, experiencing discrimination?

Carolyn Griggs: I remember my mother more so than my dad, because my dad worked weekends and, and night shifts a lot so but umm every Saturday, mostly every Saturday my mother would take us for long walks either to the zoo uhh to the park or to uhh a shopping area and it was uhh 69th in Market streets. It was a store there called Kresge’s and most people uhh would remember uhh it was like a branch of Woolworth, my mother would give us five dollars to go in and get us whatever we wanted um this one particular Saturday I had some puzzle books and um I wanted to buy uh I believe it was a necklace for my mother but I didn’t have enough money. And, so I, instead of leaving it on the counter I took it to show my older sister and the one lady uhh who was a sales clerk she was a caucasian lady she thought I was stealing it but I wasn’t I didn’t think and im like why would I steal I have money in my hand, but she umm my mother um saw her uhh chasing me and, and, and stopped me and my mother came over to me and she asked her, “to take her children out of the store, because they were stealing”. And I said no I wasn’t stealing I wanted to get this for you but I didn’t have enough money do I wanted to find my older sister to give me two more dollars so that I could buy umm so that was to me um very discriminatory, because um there was a little boy next to me who actually did take something and I saw him stick it in his pocket and I told the lady well that boy right there he took something  he put that brooch in his pocket you didn’t say anything he stole right there you didn’t say anything to him but you were looking at me probably, because I’m black. Umm so that was on incident I can remember of my mother experiencing discrimination more so, because of the color of her children and the color of her so.

​Abstract

This interview is on my neighbor Mr. Win Berd who was born in February 28, 1948. In this interview he talks about his childhood and his education. He also talks about what happened during that time and about all the challenges he face in his lifetime.

Transcript

Oral Interview

Radiatou Diarra

RD: Where were you born?

WB: I was born in Philadelphia, PA.

RD:What is your educational background?

WB: I graduated in 1965 from Ben Franklin High School. From 80-83 I was in Community College and earned an Associate’s degree.

RD: Was Benjamin Franklin that hard back then?

WB: It wasn’t that bad back then either. It was much better back then.  

RD: How old were you during the Civil Rights Movement?

WB:  OK but Civil Rights movement go way back. See I was born in 1948. The Civil Rights movement was going on during that time.

RD: What do you remember about it?

WB: I remember about how my fore parents and my parents how they was hung or lynched during that time because they was not allowed to read or write. Their white, I don’t want to call them slave masters but plantation owners used to lynch em or whip em with a whip if they was caught reading or writing during that time

RD: May I ask did it happen in the north?

WB: It did not happen in the North but it happened in the South but the North was just a bad. They were just a racist as they were in the South.

RD: Wait. So did you grow up here?

WB: Yes, I was born and raised here. I been here for 67 years.

DR: Did the Civil Rights movement change racial relations in the US. ?

WB: No it got worse during that time. Cause it’s still going on. Only thing different they are not wearing hooded sheets. They wearing 3 piece suits. I’m talking about the Klu Klux.

RD: Do you think that progress had been made from now to then?

WB: To an extent. Yes, it had been made. I never thought I would see a black president in my time. So that shows that progress has changed.

RD: Was your community, segregated like  separated?

WB: Yes, yes there were certain parts of certain areas all over the city where like black and white didn’t get along. And it still happens.

RD: Where you lived?

WB: Where I lived. I was raised in North Philly. I only been out Southwest for 1970 like 43 years.

RD: How did you feel about the Civil Rights Movement?

WB: I feel bad because it was a part of my people. How they was trying to keep us  from getting where they were at or equal rights. We were not giving that and to this day we are still not getting equal rights?

RD: Have your feelings changed

WB: To what degree? in which way?

RD: From then to now?

WB: It has changed. At one time I did not like my Caucasian brothers. But now that I see all Caucasian brothers are not bad. You have some good ones. So my feeling have changed.

RD. Thank you so much.

WB: You’re welcome.

Abstract

In the interview, my grandmother talks about what it was like being exposed to racism and people of color when she went to school in New York. She talks about the Civil Rights movement, and she shares her deep, and insightful thoughts on the prominent leaders of the Civil Rights movement.

Research

During our interview, my grandmother said something that really stuck with me. She said, “I think it (violence) was necessary so that we could appreciate Martin Luther King's contribution as a peaceful movement”. I think that this is a very deep analysis of the Civil Rights movement’s most important leaders, and I do agree with her statement of us needing the more passive-aggressive Malcolm X, to appreciate the peaceful MLK.

It is like eating a ghost pepper and then drinking a cool glass of milk afterwards. If you just drank the glass of milk on it’s own, it is a pretty normal glass of milk. But, if you eat a ghost pepper and then you drink the milk, the milk becomes this marvelous nectar that saves you from the fiery pain that is burning your mouth, and you appreciate that milk for doing so. The same thing goes for MLK and Malcolm X. Malcolm X was a Civil Rights leader who promoted the defense against white aggression, and was famous for the line “by any means necessary”, meaning that African Americans should do whatever must be done to obtain freedom. MLK spoke out against violence, believed in passive resistance, and implored the African American community to participate in nonviolent protests. If there was no Malcolm X and the “by any means necessary” form of resistance, then MLK and peaceful protesting would be appreciated less. But, since there was a more violent resistance, MLK and the nonviolent protests are appreciated much more. I think that this is a very interesting idea that my grandmother touched on during my interview with her.

Sources

http://www.history.com/topics/black-history/malcolm-x

http://www.history.com/topics/black-history/civil-rights-movement

https://lifeexaminations.wordpress.com/2011/03/14/mlk-vs-malcolm-x-similaritiesdifferences/

Transcript

Max- I am interviewing my grandmother, Peggy Harris.

Max- What is your conceptualization of race, and how has it changed?

Peggy- I think as a young kid, I certainly didn’t have much to do with people of color, and I think that it was just, you know, where we lived; the location. So, I really didn’t have much exposure, and when I first went to school in New York City, it was my first time I had actually really interacted with other people like me, but of different color, and I went to school with them. And it was the first time that I had a relationship with others that- well it was a wake-up call for me because i never realized how prejudiced I was against color until I had the experience of having friends who were of other color. So, I think it has changed over time because I recognized how discriminatory I was, and it was kind of a real shock to me, I remember when it happened. And so, I think over time, I have begun to look at people not so much as color, but as to who they are, what relationship they have with me, things we have in common, and I think that is the biggest change I've had. And, it primarily has to do with the fact that I have worked with a lot of people of different color.

MH- In your opinion, what is the role of race in society? Or is there a role?

PH- Is there a role for race? No, I don’t think so, it shouldn't be. There shouldn't be a role for race. And I think that the more we integrate, integrate, integrate at younger ages, the more we will see each other as who we are; people. But, everybody’s different, and stereotyping is really something I find myself doing at times, still. I just hope that my grandchildren don’t do it.

MH- Do you think that the racism and prejudice, along with the stereotypes, do you think that they will eventually go away?

PH- I think it probably will, eventually, one day, I don’t really know. We’re lucky in that in Philadelphia, we really have a large mix of people from all over the world. So, I think that there is more opportunity for kids being raised in the Philadelphia area to stop being- to not even be racist, even at the get-go. It’s an opportunity, and of course a lot of it depends on the parents of each generation, as to how that’s all played out.

MH- Have you recently witnessed racial, cultural, religious, gender, discrimination?

PH- You know, I probably block a lot, so I can’t really think of it. I can’t really think of any time when I was looking at people

MH- What do you remember from the Civil Rights movement?

PH- Well the first thing I remember, I was still living in South America and I was a teenager, and I remember the news reports of the lynchings. The lynchings in the South. As the Civil movement starting to become noticed, there had been a lot of lynchings in the past, but now the news was really starting to pick up on it, and I was really appalled, I couldn't believe people would do things like that to each other. Living in South America at the time I was pretty well divorced from it, it didn't affect me personally, but to this day I remember those reports of the lynchings, and I think that was the beginning of the Civil Rights movement, when people became aware of what was really happening. And it wasn't just in the South, although the lynchings only took place in the South, but it was really all over the United States.

MH- What do you think was the most significant part of the Civil Rights movement?

PH- Well there was a lot of violence, and I was in New York in school, and I remember the violence with Malcolm X, and I have since read his autobiography, and I realized that in many ways he was right, about how you are going to change the people look at you. And I think violence, I don’t like it, but I think it was necessary so that we could appreciate Martin Luther King’s contribution as a peaceful movement. I think that really helped all of us. All of my generation to change, and adapt, and to rethink this whole business with color.

PH- I never quite understood the Southern idea of race, I mean like the bombing in Birmingham, and the five little girls. I could never really understand the violence, that I never could. But I understood the violence and the anger that came out of those riots, and of course it was a time where people were rioting, students were rioting against Vietnam, and there was just an awful lot of unrest in every which way, including women, who were unhappy with being relegated the role of housewife, and never do anything with their lives other than stay at home. Not that raising children and being a wife is a bad thing, but there is more to life than just that role, and I think women wanted a piece of the action out there.

MH- In recent events such as Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown and Ferguson, and Baltimore, what do you think about the rioting?

PH- I think that it is a wake up call again, and the news media has grabbed a hold of it, so people like myself who are not involved directly, are now involved on an emotional level. Do, I think that what is going on is racism, yes I believe so. Someone mentioned, with the police action, it was militarization of the police, and I totally believe that. No longer are you innocent until proven guilty, you're guilty! And that’s what we have been told to do you know? At airports, you’re told to look around for suspicious people and report them, and goodness gracious, I think that we would do that without being told, but now we look at people and think, well are they getting a cup of coffee or... It is just stereotyping, again, and we are just looking at people as though they are guilty.

http://www.dnj.com/story/opinion/2015/01/19/like-martin-luther-king/21999739/

The Secret History Of The Word ‘ Cracker’

http://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2013/07/01/197644761/word-watch-on-crackers

Is There a Such Thing as Voluntary Segregation?

http://globalsegregation.com/is-there-such-a-thing-as-voluntary-segregation/

Transcript

CYC: How much segregation have you experienced in your life?

YC: All my life I just don't pay it no mind

CYC: how intense have the events of segregation you experienced been?

YC: they are much stronger than they were today because we have come so far to get here today

CYC: What do you remember about the following events Murder of Emmett Till,  Lunch-counter sit-ins, Freedom Rides, murder of Jimmie Lee Jackson, Bloody Sunday”?

YC: Please tell me what happened with them

CYC: Bloody sunday was a march on a bridge to ballot

YC: Bloody Thursday.

CYC: No sunday.

YC: Oh only that it  happened.

CYC: How involved were you and your family in the civil rights movement?

YC:  I guess We were very active we all played out some more than other I was the more kind of guy.

CYC: Can you give an example

YC: Militant because whatever it took i was done with it as long as it was for the proper cause

CYC: Do you see a difference in segregation from back then and today

YC: oh most definitely it's much lighter than now because it got a bit better now and they camouflage it more so.

CYC: can you explain what you mean by camouflage ?

YC: They didn’t care if people knew or not

CYC: So you feel as though segregation still exist but it is camouflage?

YC: Right.

CYC : How do you feel as though it is camouflaged ?

YC: Crackers are different now thats all because they were more aggressive with it now they try to posses it off

CYC: Other races besides caucasian and hispanic participated in the civil rights movement

YC: They do because weather the participate or not they are people of color and people don't like to realize that a lot

CYC:  Is there one  story about segregation or the civil rights movement that you would like share

YC: It would probably be life of MLK , because i didn't like him until after he was kilt isn't that strange  but i didn't like for women and  kids to get hit .  hosed down and dogs  stuck on em you know they use to stick them dogs on them people and I tell you it was so vicious I still think it's vicious

CYC:  So you feel as though it was MLK fault?

YC : Not at all he was for the right cause they was for the wrong cause.

JH; Hey I’m here with my grandma, Merian Campbell and umm so, where were you born?

MC: In Whiteville, North Carolina.

JH: So, do you think you faced racism more in North Carolina than in Philadelphia?  

MC: I-I faced it more in Philadelphia I think.

JH: What makes you think that?

MC: Well, it’s really hard to say actually- because being born in the 50s um whenever a whole lot of racism was going on, I wasn’t around it um... I wasn’t around it. Only when we went into the city. And, nobody actually bothered us, we had no problems even though we wasn’t allowed to go in the restaurants and sit down and stuff like that, but that didn’t matter because we never went to restaurants.

JH: Did you ever signs- segregation signs that said whites only and blacks only?

MC: Uh,  I’ve saw signs that said um, whites only bathroom at the bus station, um basically that’s it.

JH: Did you understand like,  why did anybody ever tell why they had those signs?

MC: Not really, it was just that we don’t go in that bathroom.

JH: So, Jim Crow laws never really impacted you.

MC: No, nope.

JH: Well, what year did you come to Philadelphia?

MC: I came to Philadelphia in 1970.

JH: So, segregation was over by that time, so what racism- did anybody say anything?

MC: Uh, Segregation was over at that time, but where we came from schools did not mix until 1970.

JH: So, besides black people in your school were there any other races.

MC: No.

JH: You told me that there were Native Americans in your um… near your hometown. They didn’t go to your school or anything?

MC: They had their own school.

JH: Did you ever talk, like were you ever friends with someone outside your race.

MC: Uh, nope.

JH: Well-

MC: Well Native Americans yes, I’m sorry. With some Native Americans, but that was it, that was only because they lived in the community.  

JH: Did any other- any whites live in your community, was your neighborhood diverse?

MC: Nope. All Black. Even it was segregated, I mean, the Native Americans lived in one section of the community and the blacks in the other. The Native Americans and the Blacks, they did you know socialize.

JH: So, they didn’t like hate each other?

MC: No.

JH: Were there any racist remarks to each other?

MC: No.

JH: Well, in my school there is a lot of self-segregation, why do you think that is?

MC: I really don’t know, maybe because they think they’re different.

JH: Well, I know there was self-segregation in your school, but you told me about our uncle, who went to an all white school. How do you think that was for him?

MC: That was when they first started mixing the schools, and he went and it was only a few blacks, uh he faced uh racism. I didn’t, because I didn’t go there.

JH: Did- Did he ever come home and like was angry or upset about what they said?

MC: At first, um, maybe the first month he had a pretty rough time, uh he didn’t really talk about it a lot it was just uh I know he got in trouble a couple of times, over somethings that was said to him.

Abstract

My grandmother, Merian Campbell, told what it was like for her in school before they stop segregated school.  She also talked about my uncle going to an interracial school and the struggles he had to face. Since, she had a brother she got to see how different the education was between white and colored school.

Research

North Carolina, though not one of the major states during civil rights movement, still faced segregation. In 1954, public schools were determined unconstitutional for being segregated. But in North Carolina the desegregated slowly. In fact, Greensboro school was the first to agree with the Brown vs Board of education laws. “In Swann v. Charlotte-Mecklenburg Board of Education, a federal court ruled that busing could be used as a tool to help integrate the public schools,” which was attempt to desegregate schools.    

Sources:

http://ncpedia.org/history/20th-Century/african-american-civil-rights

http://civilrightsproject.ucla.edu/research/k-12-education/integration-and-diversity/segregation-again-north-carolina2019s-transition-from-leading-desegregation-then-to-accepting-segregation-now

Research

Overall, in American history, the social disadvantage of blacks has been present and is obvious even though people deny it. While speaking with my grandfather he believes the white privilege or the advantage over minorities still exist, and I agree with him. There are many big situations like the Trayvon Martin case, the Ferguson situation, and some situations that have been lost in history like the MOVE Bombing are all forms of racism or actions towards black people that simply happen the way they do for being black. In the times my grandfather spoke of(civil rights movement), blacks being treated unfairly, was not frowned upon and was a normal day to day thing. Now we are in 2015, and you would think that people would be past being racist, but because it is something that is taught and passed down to later generations it still  unfortunately exist. This leads to people who would have the advantage making white supremacy something realistic, and it leads to unnecessary situations or deaths of blacks with the encounters most times.

For example, one of the situations my grandfather told me people don’t pay enough attention to was the MOVE Bombing. This was a bombing where police destroyed 65 homes which was the whole neighborhood, leaving many homeless, and an unfortunate amount killed. The MOVE group was a black group of people who took one their surnames(last names) as Africa. This group was a black liberation group, and advocated for a larger group of people which is blacks in general. They owned a house all together which they called Osage, and they would use a speakerphone to scream obscenities. Once neighbors called the police saying that they were disturbing the peace, and somehow it lead to unnecessary death and destruction. When the count of homeless and dead people, were counted everyone was black or African American, which was not a surprise.

• https://www.dosomething.org/facts/11-facts-about-racial-discrimination

• http://www.google.com/url?q=http%3A%2F%2Fglobalgrind.com%2F2013%2F09%2F26%2F11-things-you-didnt-know-about-the-time-police-bombed-an-am

erican-neighborhood-move-philadelphia-list%2F&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFQjCNF5PoJojqmcUC94gCh68eIAaUsDpw

• http://www.google.com/url?q=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rawstory.com%2F2015%2F04%2Fblack-americans-killed-by-police-in-2014-outnumbered-those-who-died-on-911%2F&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFQjCNG9AlZWALFXEFlmsSYuJUHRQQjepA

Interview between my grandfather Carlton Pryor and I, Jaden McClain,

J. M.- Ard, so the first question is how important do you think race is in America?

Grandfather- How important do I think race is in America?

J.M.- Yes

Grandfather- I think, um, race is very important in America, because America is a very multicultural country, where you have people from all different ethnic *sysities* (backgrounds) and it's important that people recognize each other as individuals rather that the way they look, the way they comb hair, the size they are, or how they speak, because life is about treating people equally.   

J.M.-Ard thank you, so um, so you know, when you were my age did you think being black, or your specific race was a dangerous thing, or people didn't like you for that?

Grandfather-When I was your age, um, race was an issue, however I was taught that your treat people the way you wanted to be treated, and to always be respectful to your elders and law enforcement. And as long as you live by credible ethics and you know that was is important is how you see yourself and how other people see you, you should not be threatened. Though I recognized that racism was there, I never let that get into the way of what I wanted to be. Ya know, and I never used the race card as a crutch. I just found ways to try to break down the barriers for example, when I tried to get a position they said, “well you don’t have this”, so I asked what do I need to do to get the position, and I went and got that certificate or degree, and I went back and they told me “I had to get something else”, and I went back until I go to the point where I backed them in a corner where they had nothing else to do except give me the position.

J.M.- So basically, they were being indirect and they didn’t want to give you a position based off of your race.

Grandfather- Well I couldn’t say, it was race related, or academia, but im pretty sure it dealt with race, but it didn't stop me from pursuing my goal.

J.M.- Right, so when you were younger when race was a big problem and you had segregation and things of that sort, were you apart of any kind of protesting or did you have anything to do with the ending of segregation?

Grandfather- Well I never was apart, well I was apart of a political group in my school when I was majoring in political science and I advocated, for treating people based on their credibility, and based on their credentials rather than the way they look, or their color. However I recognized there were rules and regulations, there was still areas all over the country through the south that was segregated, and that you still couldn’t do the things you thought you were aloud to do. For instance when I was in basic training in um, Kentucky, when I went into a restaurant to get food they ran out of food, although their were hundreds of people eating. So other than me creating an issue I went back to the base. When I was in the farm with my grandfather, and we went to the market my grandfather was very fair, and I couldn’t go in through the front door, I had to go to the back, and he couldn’t let them know that I was his grandson, because he compared to being white. So growing up you recognize boundaries that you have to deal with at that time, you had to deal with it.

J.M.- So how did that make you feel, do you think it made you a better person, or was it simply unnecessary?

Grandfather- I think um, i made me a better person, il say this you are who you are, and no one else can change you because of what they think of you, and think that you're something you're not. We were always taught that we could achieve and excel, even though I knew, and sometimes I was unhappy, and sometimes I got discouraged because I knew it was race related I didn’t let that stop me, because if you let that barrier stop you, you are laying into their hands because you become, factated.

J.M.- Right, um, hmm so for instance, if their was anything else you could have done to help, like you did with you political science, did you go around and speak to people about segregation, and how it should be fair, or was it more of a thing were you and some people just spoke about it.

Grandfather- I always told people that violence did not solve the segregation issue, what violence did was reinforce that we were arrogant, rebellious, and that we were hostile, because I recognized that I can be very expressive in my thoughts, and be considered radical, and however the white sector, who was racist or biased, felt like they were entitled to say anything, and they were just expressing their opinion. So tone, was very important, if you didn't deliver the right tone, you were not heard, if your tone was hostile back then, the actions that came upon you were different(violent). There, is an old saying that “I can catch more bees with honey than vinegar”, so  I tried very hard to portray myself as being hostile, although I knew I had to be very careful about what I said, how I presented myself because they wanted me to act in a certain manner to you their forceful will by locking me up, imprisoning me, and things of that natural, like stomping you or your front door and questioning you. So those were things you had to overcome, and even though I try hard to do that there were people who felt like just because you were black you were a hoodlum.

J.M.- So do you feel like even though certain places of the country blacks didn’t make the situation better, do you think as a culmination or whole, what people did protest wise, do you think that made a big impact?

Grandfather- I believe that today kids and generation do not understand the struggles their parents and grandparents and civil rights activist have done to get them the right to vote, sit a counters, or to walk in any restaurant. They just do not recognize that, they have not taken the time to learn their history, and quit frankly they just don’t, and the generation today has lost their morals and values.

J.M.- So what do you mean by that do you think it’s taken for granted, or it’s not appreciated as much as it should be?

Grandfather- I don’t think that the young generation doesn't respect the generation of the past, and don't respect one another. They feel that they should look for the easy way out and do not want to work for anything. Or they feel that everything should be given to them, like welfare, and they need to break the cycle. And now violence is a way of life for them, when I was coming up they had games with shooting and stabbing but there was a difference. The media is very privileged aspect, because the media promote negative things, never what kid did good or what kid acceled.

J.M.- It;s like the negatives

ABSTRACT

In this interview, my grandpa, Dr. Michael Kelly, talks about what school was like before and after the Civil Rights Movement. Towards the end, he talks about how we can help schools today. Since he was a teacher, his experiences were different than the students. He liked how schools were more diverse, and never had a problem with it.

RESEARCH

In 1945, it was decided that kids of different races should be able to attend schools. The first school to allow this was Little Rock High School. Most people did not agree with this, and stopped going to school for a while. After a while, the people started to realize that the people of different races were not going to leave, and they started going back to the schools.

SOURCES

http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/civil_rights_education.htm

http://www.civilrights.org/resources/civilrights101/desegregation.html

http://www.civilrights.org/education/brown/